|
|
Post by eric on Jun 7, 2021 12:45:28 GMT -5
20s andrewluck Ankly b. A. (good 2023) bankz delap Dirt Druce duc15 dump Handsome Pete Herby New Year! IanBoyd jhb @jayz93j kc Majic mazunga Mike Odin Chaps pointyegg Sapular skrouse Soup TinyTimPig Trofie troybarnes Yawn of the DeadWe have two concerns to balance: the sharing of draft scouting, and getting information on players. - College statsThis is easy enough to generate, reliable enough, and popular enough that continuing it indefinitely seems like the right choice. - No more pre-pick scoutingAny GM who currently has another team's pick they've traded for will still be able to pre pick scout it when they're up to draft. If the pick is traded to someone else, this grandfathering does not transfer. - Gem scoutingWe are reinstating gem scouting: GMs can pay 10k to find out if their player is a hidden gem. (Attribute scouting will continue to reveal hidden gem status.) - More post-pick scoutingAs under the current system, GMs can scout a player they have drafted up until TC. Additionally, we are introducing in season scouting: on sims 3, 6, 9, and 12 GMs can scout their own players for attributes or gem status. Rather than PMing, we will have this thread where GMs will post their scout requests, and will continue to receive the information by private message. . These reforms reduce the benefit and opportunity of having scouts shared, which should result in that part of the problem abating. The increase in information both public and post-pick should result in no significant decrease in GM ability to evaluate prospects. Feel free to chime in below with more thoughts.
|
|
|
|
Post by TinyTimPig on Jun 7, 2021 12:47:33 GMT -5
On the whole I am a fan, and implementing scouting for anyone on your roster will be a huge change.
My only concern is with the second bullet about pre-pick scouting. It seems like a lot of work for you and/or JHB to track the grandfathering of these picks for five seasons.
|
|
jhb
New Member
Posts: 1,349
Likes: 396
Joined: January 2021
|
Post by jhb on Jun 7, 2021 12:47:56 GMT -5
So you can only scout when on the clock?
|
|
|
|
Post by Druce on Jun 7, 2021 12:48:09 GMT -5
i don't understand the pre-pick scouting part
|
|
|
|
Post by TinyTimPig on Jun 7, 2021 12:49:12 GMT -5
So you can only scout when on the clock? I understood this to mean that you can only scout someone after you've picked them. |
|
bankz
New Member
GM of the Year: 3001
Posts: 2,347
Likes: 490
Joined: January 2021
|
Post by bankz on Jun 7, 2021 12:49:23 GMT -5
So a GM with no draft picks can not scout the draft?
|
|
|
|
Post by TinyTimPig on Jun 7, 2021 12:50:23 GMT -5
No "pre-pick scouting" says to me that you can't scout someone before you make your pick, even if you're on the clock.
|
|
|
|
Post by 20s on Jun 7, 2021 12:52:45 GMT -5
Can you scout a pick that is your own teams originally? The section only seems to address other team’s picks that have been traded.
|
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
Likes:
Joined: January 1970
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2021 12:53:04 GMT -5
So you can only scout when on the clock?
no there is no longer any draft scouting until after you pick
unless you traded for a pick before he announced this change
smdh
|
|
|
|
Post by TinyTimPig on Jun 7, 2021 12:53:58 GMT -5
So you can only scout when on the clock?
no there is no longer any draft scouting until after you pick
unless you traded for a pick before he announced this change
smdh
Not sure if you noticed that it's a poll and no change has been implemented yet. Hth. |
|
IanBoyd
New Member
Posts: 792
Likes: 252
Joined: December 2020
|
Post by IanBoyd on Jun 7, 2021 12:54:16 GMT -5
donotlike
|
|
Soup
New Member
Posts: 1,307
Likes: 401
Joined: January 2021
|
Post by Soup on Jun 7, 2021 12:57:11 GMT -5
changing this shit 8 years into a sim is so irresponsible. after many GMs have had the advantage of scouting, you fuck over anyone who has not had the chance to benefit from it that were about to.
this change is all about ego. not good for the league.
|
|
|
|
Post by eric on Jun 7, 2021 13:12:54 GMT -5
On the whole I am a fan, and implementing scouting for anyone on your roster will be a huge change. My only concern is with the second bullet about pre-pick scouting. It seems like a lot of work for you and/or JHB to track the grandfathering of these picks for five seasons. it has worked out pretty easily for uppies coaches so i don't anticipate it being that hard |
|
|
|
Post by eric on Jun 7, 2021 13:13:35 GMT -5
So you can only scout when on the clock? to be extremely precise it's when it's your turn to draft, whether the timer has started yet or not |
|
|
|
Post by eric on Jun 7, 2021 13:14:59 GMT -5
changing this shit 8 years into a sim is so irresponsible. after many GMs have had the advantage of scouting, you fuck over anyone who has not had the chance to benefit from it that were about to. this change is all about ego. not good for the league. we changed the entire draft system multiple times in 5.0, which is how we ended up empirically proving which was the best one (wheel) surely you can agree these reforms are an extremely minor change in comparison |
|
bankz
New Member
GM of the Year: 3001
Posts: 2,347
Likes: 490
Joined: January 2021
|
Post by bankz on Jun 7, 2021 13:19:56 GMT -5
These are not minor changes.
|
|
|
|
Post by eric on Jun 7, 2021 13:21:19 GMT -5
These are not minor changes. the operative phrase was in comparison |
|
bankz
New Member
GM of the Year: 3001
Posts: 2,347
Likes: 490
Joined: January 2021
|
Post by bankz on Jun 7, 2021 13:29:57 GMT -5
These are not minor changes. the operative phrase was in comparisonWho’s gives a shit what you did with half a league worth of GMs. |
|
|
|
Post by eric on Jun 7, 2021 13:37:04 GMT -5
the operative phrase was in comparisonWho’s gives a shit what you did with half a league worth of GMs. people interested in making the right decision should when one of those changes (wheel) resulted in +10 GMs people interested in impotently attempting potshots wouldn't care about that or any other fact, i assume |
|
|
|
Post by Majic on Jun 7, 2021 13:39:55 GMT -5
Offering my opinion
I dont particularly care about scout sharing. We have had multiple drafts where the best players were selected outside of the Top 3 picks. Scouting is extremely helpful and necessary to ensure a GM doesn't get screwed on a top pick but it also doesnt mean its screwing GMs as a whole.
Additionally, outside of the draft the scouting information doesn't do much. By the time a player reaches the market its obvious who is, and is not, very good.
I would endorse a rule change that limited a GM to scouting only when it was their pick. This would likely cause the draft to take a bit longer, which I am personally OK with.
|
|
|
|
Post by Trofie on Jun 7, 2021 13:45:26 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by skrouse on Jun 7, 2021 13:47:20 GMT -5
- No more pre-pick scoutingAny GM who currently has another team's pick they've traded for will still be able to pre pick scout it when they're up to draft. If the pick is traded to someone else, this grandfathering does not transfer. This seems like it unnecessarily penalizes GMs that have high picks in the next five drafts and will give an advantage to those who traded for picks. Should be all or none IMO. Also, I think we should still have the ability to scout the Potential attribute Pre-Pick. |
|
Deleted
Posts: 0
Likes:
Joined: January 1970
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2021 13:47:54 GMT -5
I'd prefer to just release the full builds for rookies (and do the part from this proposal that is in-season scouting as well to keep the skrouse flowing).
I really just have a lot of fun deciding on what players to take based on the builds. Stats scouting is not even remotely close to the same thing.
Perhaps this idea could get a vote before we pick status quo vs this proposal?
|
|
|
|
Post by Odin on Jun 7, 2021 14:21:08 GMT -5
i like some things here
i hate no more pre pick scouting
|
|
|
|
Post by TinyTimPig on Jun 7, 2021 14:26:55 GMT -5
At this point I'm voting for no changes. I'm not super interested in seeing the drama that will unfold (and has already unfolded) if we have a massive scouting overhaul.
It'd be cool if people stopped sharing scouts but it appears they're fundamentally incapable of doing so and the consequences for trying to limit sharing aren't worth it.
|
|
Handsome Pete
New Member
Posts: 1,118
Likes: 581
Joined: January 2021
|
Post by Handsome Pete on Jun 7, 2021 14:42:01 GMT -5
I think in general people are resistant to change and will find a million reasons why a change won't work. I think Eric's point in shout about the resistance to the wheel is a very good one, as people's hate for the wheel seems largely to have gone away now that they've seen it in practice.
I think we should be open to experimenting with things here to keep trying to find the right balance. Scouting makes the draft a lot more enjoyable than it was in 4.0. College stats are a great addition. I like them both in concert.
I think it was Majic that suggested keeping both, but putting a cap on the number of scouts a GM could use. Maybe we could adapt that here. A limited number of scouts per team aka "in person workouts", then unlimited scouting so you can get a guy's build post-selection.
|
|
|
|
Post by TinyTimPig on Jun 7, 2021 14:46:22 GMT -5
I think it was Majic that suggested keeping both, but putting a cap on the number of scouts a GM could use. Maybe we could adapt that here. A limited number of scouts per team aka "in person workouts", then unlimited scouting so you can get a guy's build post-selection. The issue here is that is does nothing to solve the scout sharing issue that was described. I scout Players A, B, C, D. You scout players E, F, G, H. That info can easily be swapped. |
|
|
|
Post by Majic on Jun 7, 2021 14:47:55 GMT -5
few proposals I have mentioned before but wanted to state again.
Is there any support for limiting the amount of scouts? GM gets 3 scouts per pick, an assistance coach would get them 1 more. They couldnt be traded.
What about the idea of scouting only while on the clock? This could slow the draft a bit but would likely limit the amount of sharing. I really wouldnt mind the offseason being a tad longer as we are ripping off seasons pretty quickly.
just a couple additional ideas that might help
|
|
|
|
Post by skrouse on Jun 7, 2021 14:48:07 GMT -5
I think it was Majic that suggested keeping both, but putting a cap on the number of scouts a GM could use. Maybe we could adapt that here. A limited number of scouts per team aka "in person workouts", then unlimited scouting so you can get a guy's build post-selection. The issue here is that is does nothing to solve the scout sharing issue that was described. I scout Players A, B, C, D. You scout players E, F, G, H. That info can easily be swapped. Or given away for free |
|
|
|
Post by Majic on Jun 7, 2021 14:49:11 GMT -5
I think in general people are resistant to change and will find a million reasons why a change won't work. I think Eric's point in shout about the resistance to the wheel is a very good one, as people's hate for the wheel seems largely to have gone away now that they've seen it in practice. I think we should be open to experimenting with things here to keep trying to find the right balance. Scouting makes the draft a lot more enjoyable than it was in 4.0. College stats are a great addition. I like them both in concert. I think it was Majic that suggested keeping both, but putting a cap on the number of scouts a GM could use. Maybe we could adapt that here. A limited number of scouts per team aka "in person workouts", then unlimited scouting so you can get a guy's build post-selection. see my recent post. also, I still 100% hate wheel and would vote to get rid of it if given the chance. I just simply enjoy the league more than I hate the wheel so I still with it. |
|
