Rookie Ladder - 3022 (234 views)

[delap]

PreSeason

So the first thing I check every time I do these rankings is the P/TSA for the players. There is no scientific reason, other than our brains liking round numbers, for me to set an arbitrary cut-off of 1.000 P/TSA as a marker, but that's what I do. It's a useful cut-off to look for depth, guys that could blossom a bit more, etc. The whole point of this story is that this year's class is absolutely barren compared to previous classes in terms of the # of players (with enough qualifying minutes, sorry Jevon Crudup) shooting at least 1.000 P/TSA. For comparison:

(all solely based on PreSeason)

3019: 34 qualifying players with at least 1.000 P/TSA

3020: 30 qualifying players with at least 1.000 P/TSA

3021: 28 qualifying players with at least 1.000 P/TSA

3022: 19 qualifying players with at least 1.000 P/TSA

Is this an player build trend or just a random occurrence? I dunno, but this class is not looking super deep and I don't see any surefire studs either. I hope it's just small sample, but some of the more anticipated players just look like trash... and Eddie Jones didn't even play. Hopefully Grant Hill and Jalen Rose can learn from their mistakes and appear on the Day 40 update.

Anywho... onto the ladder.

1. Juwan Howard - Utah Jazz

One of a very small handful of players at 1.07 or higher, Howard is 6th in P/TSA on decent volume. He has very low TOs and his defensive numbers are good enough that he should be fine with natural growth on that end. Rebounding is a bit weak, so by no means does he have the top spot on lock... it's just his for now.

2. Glenn Robinson - Milwaukee Bucks

We knew he would have rebounding troubles, and those are evident. We also knew that his TOs would be high... but they don't look SUPER bad considering his higher usage rate. He is the best offensive player in the class, ranking as the top scorer from a human-GMed team and is #2 in P/TSA. He has a flaw or two, but overall still looks very good.

3a. Lawrence Funderburke - Los Angeles Lakers

3b. Brian Grant - Atlanta Hawks

Didn't play enough to garner a ton of minutes, but appeared enough to get an idea of his skills. #2 in rebounding in the class and decent defensive output, Larry Fundyburky could be a good offensive player, too, if his upgrades go to his putrid jumpshot. Pete will likely need to decide between that and going all out to max rebounding and shot blocking. Tough call. Very similar to Funderburke, Grant is the #1 rebounder in the class, takes care of the ball, and with some jumpshot love could be a skilled offender as well. His defensive counting stats are a little weak, which should force King's hand to focus on the offensive game and rebounding with upgrades, but we'll see how that goes.

5. Dontonio Wingfield - Seattle SuperSonics

Dongtonio finds his way on the list as a do-everything wing with decent potential. He's #1 in P/TSA, but rarely shoots. That said, he's a great rebounder from the wing, averages almost a block/36, and doesn't turn it over. He doesn't have star upside, but he's probably a pretty sure bet to slot in as a rotation wing for a good bit of time.

6. Jason Kidd - Utah Jazz

One of the sub-1.000 P/TSAers to make the list, Kidd was actually a somewhat solid 10th in PER among rookies in the PreSeason. Outside of his shooting woes, he looks very good as a rookie, with incredibly low TOs and strong rebounding from the 1.

7. Eric Montross - Dallas Mavericks

The leader in blocked shots by a wide margin, Montross looks to be easily fixable (jumpshot upgrade) on offense and have the natural acumen to rebound well and play top-notch defense. Good base to build from here.

8. Kevin Salvadori - Pittsburgh Pipers

He scores well despite being one of the worst FT shooters in the group, so he could probably actually turn into an offensive threat with a big dump into jumpshot. His rebounds are solid and will grow, but the shot-blocking never will. He's here because his TOs are so low, despite decent usage, that he really could be a strong offensive big with the right love.

9. Voshon Lenard - Carolina Cougars

We've reached the bottom of the ladder, known as the Cougars Section. Voshon is a strong #3 in P/TSA! He averages 1.7 steals/36 (#3 in the class)! But... those TOs. Yikes. 4 per 36 is a tough pill to swallow... if he gets that fixed he could be a really strong player, he's in the wait and see category for sure.

10. Kevin Rankin - Carolina Cougars

A double-dip in Carolina... because someone had to get the last spot... it might as well be this guy who sounds made up. He's a really good rebounder and kinda OK at most everything else. He'll likely be relegated to a bench spot for most of the year, but he can enjoy this brief moment in the sun and keep Cougs Fans on the message boards hopeful for the future.

Honorable Mentions:

Points:

Trevor Ruffin - Chicago Stags

Wings:

None

Bigs:

Donyell Marshall - Vancouver Grizzlies

Shawnelle Scott - Orlando Magic

Rodney Dent - Toronto Raptors

Yinka Dare - Charlotte Hornets

[delap]

Day 40

Wow this class is incredibly shallow. It looks even worse than it did in the PreSeason. On the other hand, the top end looks a little more clear and a little better (especially with the introduction of Grant Hill's uppies... but let's not talk about Eddie Jones) than before.

1. Grant Hill - Utah Jazz (previous: NR)
What a difference some Inside Uppies make. Hill still isn't killing it on defense, but he can score and rebound and is efficient. His TOs will have to rely on natural progression at this point, but there's a decent chance that happens.



2. Glenn Robinson - Milwaukee Bucks (previous: 2)
Almost identical to Hill, just without any rebounding prowess at all. He's a solid player, but leaves you wanting a bit on defense, too. If he gets some natural growth in rebounding or steals, though, he'll be a higher-end starter.



3. Jason Kidd - Utah Jazz (previous: 6)
Efficiency has gone up and TOs are still incredibly low for a rookie PG. Solid steal rate and rebound rate, too. He may not ever be a guard that propels a title team, but he could absolutely be the steady hand for a championship team.



4a. Yinka Dare - Anaheim Amigos (previous: HM)
4b. Juwan Howard - Utah Jazz (previous: 1)
4c. Kevin Salvadori - Pittsburgh Pipers (previous: 8)
Grouped together by a common P/TSA and lack of defense, these 3 all have solid parts of their games, along with some glaring weaknesses. Howard is weak weak on the boards, but plausibly be a leading scorer type. Salvadori and Dare are great rebounders, but Dare isn't a top scorer and Salvadori REALLY won't block any shots. Dare had the highest starting potential, though, so I think he could get some defensive growth and turn out the best of this bunch. None of them suffer from TO issues, which is a nice bonus.





7. Eric Montross - Dallas Mavericks (previous: 7)
The Montrossity is just a step below the trio above because of his relative turnover issues and Howard-like weak rebounding. That said, he's a strong scorer and shot-blocker, which is nothing to be upset about. Solid 3rd big type for sure.



8. Greg Minor - Carolina Cougars (previous: NR)
Carolingians will likely want to see Voshon Lenard's name here... but too bad. Minor isn't a sexy player and isn't putting up volume anywhere, but he's #1 in the class in P/TSA for now and isn't a negative anywhere, really (except maybe steal-rate.) He might be an OK Player.



9. Brian Grant - Atlanta Hawks (previous: 3b)
Strong rebounder, OK scorer, similar to the other bigs in that he doesn't really play defense and doesn't really turn it over. The lack of interior defense in this class is really impressive.



10. Charlie Ward - Pittsburgh Pipers (previous: NR)
After an absolutely terrible PreSeason I was worried about my guy Charlie. However, he looks like he still has a smidge of hope. Similar to Kidd, he doesn't turn it over and plays some defense. Unlike Kidd, he doesn't rebound and is pretty inefficient. Maybe he'll be something? I hope so!



Honorable Mentions:

Points:
None

Wings:
Dwayne Morton - Orlando Magic

Bigs:
Logan Vander Velden - Miami Heat

[Deleted]

dare to be different

[delap]

Day 90 Update


1. Grant Hill - Utah Jazz (previous: 1)
TOs are a little better, but scoring a rebounding are slightly down, steals are down too. He's definitely not running away with this top spot. If he can get his numbers closer to the Day 40 update by the end of the year he'll have a much better chance of holding on. He's still 3rd in P/TSA and 3rd in PER (1st among non-bigs).



2. Jason Kidd - Utah Jazz (previous: 3)
The stiffest competition for Hill is currently his teammate, who also has a 4 letter last name with repeating consonants. Suspicious, right? Kidd isn't a fantastic scorer, but otherwise is pretty close to a perfect PG. His rebounding is very strong for his position and he steals it more often than he gives it up.



3. Glenn Robinson - Milwaukee Bucks (previous: 2)
1st in P/TSA and a very strong offensive force... he just lacks defense and rebounding. His TOs have inched up a bit, surpassing those of Hill actually. If he were slightly better at any of his deficits he could be a much stronger player, but the variety of weaknesses right now is really capping his ceiling, despite his offensive bona fides.



4. Eric Montross - Dallas Mavericks (previous: 7)
4th in P/TSA and 2nd in raw scoring, Montross, like everyone in this class, has a glaring weakness to go along with some otherwise intriguing strengths... he can't rebound. Aside from that he's great. He's also less likely to grow than those around him, which does limit his future.



5. Juwan Howard - Utah Jazz (previous: 4b
A lot like Montross, including the atrocious rebounding... but doesn't bring the defensive chops either. On offense he's a smooth operator, where he is 2nd in the class in P/TSA and 1st in raw scoring. One upside, a low TO rate!



6. Yinka Dare - Anaheim Amigos (previous: 4a)
Not a willing scorer, but fairly efficient when he does want to shoot, Dare is the #2 rebounder in the class and isn't a slouch on defense (but not a stud either).



7. Kevin Salvadori - Pittsburgh Pipers (previous: 4c)
He seems like the archetype for a 3rd big. He isn't a great defender, but scores enough and efficiently enough in a pinch. He rebounds pretty well. But... he's probably not getting any better. If he gets some TC luck to his shot blocking or jumpshot maybe he has a future as a low-end starter.



8. Brian Grant - Atlanta Hawks (previous: 9)
Grant moves up just because competition at this point is real weak. He's a rebounding machine (tops in the class by a big margin) and that's his real calling card. The rest of his game isn't particularly note-worthy.



9. Thomas Hamilton - New York Knicks (previous: NR)
A futures pick, Hamilton is brimming with potential and mass. He's a bit weak on the boards, isn't terribly efficient (but not awful either), and his defense is better than average. He isn't a finished product by any stretch, but by year 3-4 of his career he could end up being very solid.



10. Eddie Jones - Dallas Mavericks (previous: NR)
Still a mystery how he isn't better, given what I remember of his build. He definitely has potential to grow, so that puts him above the rest of the dregs right now. His steal rate is incredible and his TO rate is incredibly low... so that's good. He just doesn't want to score, so I don't know if his ceiling is anything other than a role/glue type guy.



Honorable Mentions:

Points:
Charlie Ward - Pittsburgh Pipers
Voshon Lenard - Carolina Cougars

Wings:
Greg Minor - Carolina Cougars

Bigs:
Rodney Dent - Toronto Raptors
Charles Claxton - Cleveland Cavaliers
Logan Vander Velden - Miami Heat

[Dirt]

Eddie Jones out here playing naked

[delap]

Final Standings
This is the least confident I've been in selecting the Rookie Ladder year-end #1. Robinson, Hill, Kidd, and Montross are all pretty equal in talent/future output in my mind and I don't really want to choose, but alas, heavy is the head that ranks the rookies and I have to suck it up and pick. Those 4 are the top tier, then comes Juwan Howard in his own tier... then the rest. I don't expect any of this class to be making regular All-Star appearances, pretty underwhelming on the whole.

So... congrats to Fason and Grant Hill (I guess?). TinyTimPig please give him 1k from my bank

1. Grant Hill - Utah Jazz (previous: 1)
3rd in PER, 5th in P/TSA... and playable, but not great TOs. He lands at the top because his rebounding and defensive edge over Robinson. He should have a good chance at natural growth as well.



2. Glenn Robinson - Milwaukee Bucks (previous: 3)
An offensive juggernaut (1st in P/TSA and one of the better rookie scoring profiles we've ever seen)... but his rebounding is major problem (not Rolando Blackman in 5.0 bad, but still bad) and his defensive stats are equally worrisome.



3. Eric Montross - Dallas Mavericks (previous: 4)
4th in P/TSA and some impressive defensive numbers (especially in this class that really lacks interior defenders)... but like Robinson, and at a position of greater importance... his rebounding is very weak. He may not have a ton of natural growth left, but at least rebounding is the one metrics where bigs can get better even without a ton of shown POT.



4. Jason Kidd - Utah Jazz (previous: 2)
Not the sexiest player, but he's a steady-handed PG right out of the gate and should push the lower limit of the software's invisible barriers of TOs/36. A strong rebounder and efficient shooter, he isn't an elite scorer, but that is really the only ding against him.



5. Juwan Howard - Utah Jazz (previous: 5)
2nd in P/TSA and a pretty impressive low TO rate, Howard is everything you want in a scoring big... and almost nothing you want in a rebounding or defending one. He's stuck relying on natural growth to at solve at least one of those... or maybe half-solve both. Either way, Fason has got to be hoping that the training staff along the Wasatch Front is ready to work overtime the next few off-seasons.



6. Yinka Dare - Anaheim Amigos (previous: 6)
If he can learn to score in bunches (a really big IF at this point) he'd be much higher on the list. He rebounds, plays some intriguing defense, 3rd in P/TSA, and had strong starting potential. Good player.



7. Thomas Hamilton - New York Knicks (previous: 9)
He could stand to be more efficient, but he has very high potential and it should correct his average rebounding and boost his pretty decent defense. Some positive improvement from the FT line could do some wonders, too.



8. Brian Grant - Atlanta Hawks (previous: 8)
I love a player with a well-defined super strength, where you know what you are getting... and Brian Grant on the boards is just that. Everything else is playable or above-average, so that's a bonus.



9. Eddie Jones - Dallas Mavericks (previous: 10)
Eddie "Playing Naked" Jones, as the locals call him, is a tabula rasa with lots of potential. The things you can point to now are a strong steal-rate and no TOs, which is a good starting point.



10. Kevin Salvadori - Pittsburgh Pipers (previous: 7)
He's a guy who can put up some stats, right? But his defense is really bad and I don't see anything more than maybe 3rd-big potential here.



Honorable Mentions:

Points:
Voshon Lenard - Carolina Cougars

Wings:
Greg Minor - Carolina Cougars

Bigs:
Rodney Dent - Toronto Raptors
Charles Claxton - Cleveland Cavaliers

[Sapular]

100k

[Trofie]

100k

tmbslsix.proboards.com/thread/4149/bucks-block?page=1&scrollTo=36225

[Handsome Pete]

80k

[Fason]

85k

[TinyTimPig]

90,000 + 10,000 bonus for having to suffer through writing about this class four times.