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Post by eric on Jan 25, 2021 10:00:01 GMT -5
There's been a lot of talk in shout about this recently so I wanted to make sure everyone knew the score.
Handshake deals are not illegal, not enforceable, and not valuable.
Illegal: there's no way to police communication between GMs, so making any communication between GMs illegal is pointless.
Enforceable: there's no way to police communication between GMs, so any proof offered by one GM would be taking only that GM at their word, which is necessary but not sufficient to process a trade.
Valuable: since these deals are not enforceable, they have no value when it comes to evaluating trades. Therefore, a trade such as...
GM 1 sends
Player A
40k currency
GM 2 sends
a promise to spend 30 upgrade points on player A
a promise to send player A back in the future
...is something for nothing, which is an automatic veto.
Additionally, a trade intended and agreed to by both GMs as the second half of a prior trade will be evaluated only on its own merits - if GMs 1 and 2 had gotten player A to GM 2 legally, the evaluation of getting player A back to GM 1 would not take into account whether GM 2 had spent upgrade points on them, whether GM 2 had promised to do so, whether GM 2 met or exceeded those promises, etc.
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Post by 20s on Jan 25, 2021 10:05:17 GMT -5
Illegal: there's no way to police communication between GMs Not with an attitude like that. |
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Post by Herby New Year! on Jan 25, 2021 10:11:41 GMT -5
So much for universal surveillance . . .
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Post by 20s on Jan 25, 2021 10:13:14 GMT -5
Defund the communication police!
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Soup
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Posts: 1,307
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Post by Soup on Jan 25, 2021 10:47:10 GMT -5
Something for nothing happens all the time when clearing cap space.
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Post by Yawn of the Dead on Jan 25, 2021 11:01:16 GMT -5
We shouldn't be doing handshake deals with COVID
Socially Distanced Winks only
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Post by Odin on Jan 25, 2021 11:01:21 GMT -5
Something for nothing happens all the time when clearing cap space. no, thats something for cap space which is a very important asset |
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Post by skrouse on Jan 25, 2021 11:01:43 GMT -5
Something for nothing happens all the time when clearing cap space. Cap space =/= nothing imo |
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Soup
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Post by Soup on Jan 25, 2021 11:05:58 GMT -5
Something for nothing happens all the time when clearing cap space. Cap space =/= nothing imo right, so you can use that excuse every time. There's no way to prove your move isn't to clear cap space. |
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Post by Odin on Jan 25, 2021 11:08:37 GMT -5
Cap space =/= nothing imo right, so you can use that excuse every time. There's no way to prove your move isn't to clear cap space. thats fine because if the player is too good to dump for only cap it will get vetoed. |
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Soup
New Member
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Post by Soup on Jan 25, 2021 11:10:17 GMT -5
right, so you can use that excuse every time. There's no way to prove your move isn't to clear cap space. thats fine because if the player is too good to dump for only cap it will get vetoed. if you're going to have rules, you should have rules. There shouldn't be very little room for judgement calls. That could get sketchy. |
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Post by Odin on Jan 25, 2021 11:14:10 GMT -5
thats fine because if the player is too good to dump for only cap it will get vetoed. if you're going to have rules, you should have rules. There shouldn't be very little room for judgement calls. That could get sketchy. for the record we had about 1.5 vetoed trades in 5.0 under eric. he doesnt make judgement calls. |
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bankz
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Post by bankz on Jan 25, 2021 11:43:26 GMT -5
Who else had trades veto’d in 5.0 that didn’t involve Odin?
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Post by Odin on Jan 25, 2021 12:18:28 GMT -5
Who else had trades veto’d in 5.0 that didn’t involve Odin? none of them involved me. in fact i actually cant think of more than 1, bk/ward artis gilmore and that was easily reworked. |
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Post by delap on Jan 25, 2021 12:19:51 GMT -5
Who else had trades veto’d in 5.0 that didn’t involve Odin?
I think there was a druce/majic one?
Maybe that was just the one that got everyone really mad.
I don't recall.
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Post by TinyTimPig on Jan 25, 2021 12:23:22 GMT -5
Who else had trades veto’d in 5.0 that didn’t involve Odin?
I think there was a druce/majic one?
Maybe that was just the one that got everyone really mad.
I don't recall.
That wasn't a veto iirc. It was an issue with money. |
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Post by skrouse on Jan 25, 2021 12:25:51 GMT -5
Cap space =/= nothing imo right, so you can use that excuse every time. There's no way to prove your move isn't to clear cap space. FWIW, these mostly happen during the offseason to create space for resignings or shortly after FA or a trade that puts you over the Hard Cap. In those situations, a trade for cap space makes your roster legal or allows you to make additional moves, so that's the "something."
Because salaries have to match, you can't just trade away a superstar for literally nothing. You have to send back salary (unless the team taking salary is under the soft cap). That would be the only scenario I can think of right now where "trading for cap space" may not fit the situation and people could complain about it.
It's been pretty cut and dry honestly, like odin said, we've only have a handful of vetos and I can't think of anything earth shattering, ala IRL CP3 to the LAL being nixed.
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Post by TinyTimPig on Jan 25, 2021 13:26:13 GMT -5
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Post by Majic on Jan 25, 2021 13:42:42 GMT -5
Who else had trades veto’d in 5.0 that didn’t involve Odin?
I think there was a druce/majic one?
Maybe that was just the one that got everyone really mad.
I don't recall.
Yes we did, lead to Druce quitting again. Was the trade that involved Bonga going to him and my getting AJ Guyton. Can't remember why Eric veto'ed it. We ultimately made the trade work without druce and with the help of Tim. |
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