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Post by delap on Mar 5, 2021 7:44:53 GMT -5
Sorry for the delay, gents. The first iteration will still be entirely based on the Pre-Season stats.
Pre-Season Rookie Ladder
No real standouts, no obvious stars... so expect a lot of movement once these guys are playing regular season minutes and playing against the best of the best. However, I do see a good number of guys with potential to be consistent rotation players in the future... but I'd set the O/U on All-Stars from this group at 1.5
1. Rick Mahorn - Los Angeles Clippers Top 5 in efficiency and rebounding, while not turning the ball over very much. Volume is strong and with upgrades should only increase.
2. Kevin McHale - Cleveland Cavaliers Solid efficiency, but tops in scoring volume and 3rd in blocks. The major knock on McHale is obviously his handling, where he's averaging nearly 4 TOs/36. That's the only thing keeping him from the top spot right now.
3. Kelvin Ransey - Golden State Warriors Another year, another PG prospect for the Dubs. Ransey looks to be the cream of the PG crop, with low TOs, solid efficiency and volume. His steal rate is pretty good for a rookie, too, and should grow naturally.
4. Michael Brooks - Brooklyn Nets Strong showing of rebounding from a wing with decent efficiency and above-average volume. Brooks has a very slight TO problem, but not nearly as egregious as McHale or some of the guys that follow.
5. Jawann Oldham - New York Knicks You guys know how I feel about no-shoot high-block bigs.... I adore them. Oldham is first in blocks and stocks by a mile, nearly doubling #2 in blocks. He also has a minuscule TO rate compared to most other players in the class.
6. Lavon Mercer - Cleveland Cavaliers 2nd in blocks, 2nd in stocks... and a decent rebounder and scorer. He has TO issues, like most everyone else in the class.
7. Roosevelt Bouie - Seattle SuperSonics 8. Jeff Ruland - Chicago Bulls Two bigs that should eventually work their way to starting roles with similar outputs for the PreSeason. Bouie is a rare player without TO issues in this class, but his ceiling is likely limited by lower potential. Ruland's rebounding could be an elite skill, but he'll be otherwise derailed if he can't fix his TO rate.
9. Kiki Vandeweghe - Carolina Cougars 10. Mike O'Koren - Brooklyn Nets Two solid wings, whose focus should be on offense. O'Koren is efficient, but lack of volume may limit his ceiling. Vandeweghe wants to shoot, but isn't hyper efficient. However, O'Koren was a HIDDEN GEM and Vandeweghe has solid potential, so I see upside in both of these guys going forward.
Honorable Mentions:
Points: Lorenzo Romar - Vancouver Grizzlies
Wings: Tony Fuller - Los Angeles Clippers Chad Kinch - New York Knicks Bruce Collins - Seattle SuperSonics Dick Miller - Minnesota Timberwolves Andrew Toney - Golden State Warriors
Bigs: Darrell Allums - New York Knicks Rickey Brown - Minnesota Timberwolves DeWayne Scales - Chicago Stags Mike Gminski - San Antonio Spurs Michael Wiley - Pittsburgh Pipers
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Post by 20s on Mar 5, 2021 8:03:42 GMT -5
Gross
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Post by wardunn on Mar 5, 2021 8:17:15 GMT -5
no Andrew Toney?
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Post by delap on Mar 5, 2021 8:23:01 GMT -5
meant to include him in HM... that 4.0 TO/36 is gross
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Post by wardunn on Mar 5, 2021 8:25:54 GMT -5
meant to include him in HM... that 4.0 TO/36 is gross
yes it was, halved that Sim 1 after uppies. |
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Post by Sapular on Mar 5, 2021 8:30:22 GMT -5
50K
Happy to have drafted 2 players in the ladder.
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bankz
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Post by bankz on Mar 5, 2021 10:03:38 GMT -5
Larry Drew Sr. getting zero respect. Not even a honorable mention?
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Post by Dirt on Mar 5, 2021 10:06:54 GMT -5
Pre-season based. Half the league don't start their elite
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bankz
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Post by bankz on Mar 5, 2021 10:08:29 GMT -5
Pre-season based. Half the league don't start their elite True, this is a wise man |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2021 12:39:17 GMT -5
will be interested to see what this latter looks like after michael brooks wins MVP/FMVP
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Post by Dirt on Mar 5, 2021 12:45:33 GMT -5
will be interested to see what this latter looks like after michael brooks wins MVP/FMVP Congrats on beating bullets x2 Clippers Bobcats Hornets. Print the shirts and plan the parade!! |
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Post by Sapular on Mar 5, 2021 13:07:40 GMT -5
will be interested to see what this latter looks like after michael brooks wins MVP/FMVP you means comes in 2nd? |
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Post by delap on Mar 8, 2021 9:54:43 GMT -5
Day 40 UpdateClass looks much better after the regular season has started/upgrades have helped with efficiency and TOs on the whole. However, I think I still feel pretty good about the All-Star O/U line at 1.5 ... I might push it up to 2 (because of Kiki) down the line. This update may prove controversial... because I'm having a hard time parsing spots 4-15. Class looks deep with pretty decent talent. Don't whinge until we get to Day 80 at least to see some separation and a bigger sample size. 1. Kevin McHale - Cleveland Cavaliers (previous: 2)Easy pick. 1st in scoring, 2nd in efficiency, 1st in PER, 1st(tie) in blocks... McHale is the real deal.  2. Kiki Vandeweghe - Carolina Cougars (previous: 9)What a glow-up from the PreSeason. 4th in efficiency, 2nd in scoring, and no real increase in TOs. I'd love to see a hair more rebounding or defense, but Kiki is a very nice looking scorer.  3. Michael Brooks - Brooklyn Nets (previous: 4)Significantly better rebounder than Kiki, but significantly less efficient. The gap is really narrow between 2 and 3 right now.  4. Mike O'Koren - Brooklyn Nets (previous: 10)Kiki-lite. Just a little bit worse at basically everything.  5. Rick Mahorn - Indiana Pacers (previous: 1)Pretty clearly not the top player in the class, as he was in the PreSeason output... but he's still solid and is a massive rebounder who low TOs don't appear to be a mirage. This writer would love to see more blocks from Big Rick going forward.  6. Andrew Toney - Golden State Warriors (previous: HM)Volume scorer, poor efficiency... but his TO issues from PreSeason seem to have gone away. He could vault up the ranks with increased efficiency. Pretty decent steal rate already.  7. Kelvin Ransey - Golden State Warriors (previous: 3)Still the preeminent PG in the class, looks very very similar to his PreSeason output, just got passed by players who looked better this go-round.  8. Lavon Mercer - Cleveland Cavaliers (previous: 6)Like Ransey, he didn't get worse... others just look better. He still looks like the best defensive big in the class, rebounds well, and even scores in double-digits to boot.  9. Mike Gminski - San Antonio Spurs (previous: HM)
10. Kurt Rambis - Indiana Pacers (previous:NR)Gminski's steal rate is exemplary, Rambis' TO rate is incredibly low, and both are very efficient. Gminski gets the nod because of his scoring volume.   Honorable Mentions:
Points:
Ronnie Lester - New York Knicks
Eddie Lee - Carolina Cougars
Larry Drew Sr. - Philadelphia 76ers
Wings:
Tony Fuller - Los Angeles Clippers
Craig Shelton - Charlotte Hornets
Bruce Collins - Seattle SuperSonics
John Stroud - Miami Heat
Darrell Griffith - Texas Chaparrals
Bigs:
Larry Smith - Brooklyn Nets
Rickey Brown - Minnesota Timberwolves
Brad Branson - Brooklyn Nets
Reggie Johnson - San Antonio Spurs
Roosevelt Bouie - Seattle SuperSonics
Michael Wiley - Pittsburgh Pipers
James Ray - Texas Chaparrals
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2021 10:00:10 GMT -5
rambis over smith is perplexing to me but the rest i agree with... good stuff
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Post by Sapular on Mar 8, 2021 10:21:31 GMT -5
Funny how McHale was not given the run he deserved at draft time. Also loving my 2.1 pick. Watch out boys...things are about to happen
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mazunga
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Post by mazunga on Mar 9, 2021 11:42:26 GMT -5
Craig shelton getting screwed.
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Post by Ankly on Mar 9, 2021 12:20:15 GMT -5
Oldham > Mercer
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Post by delap on Mar 12, 2021 13:36:12 GMT -5
Day 80 UpdateThis is a hard ladder this year... there is a clear #1, so at least there's that... but I could pretty easily make this 18-20 rungs with quality players. I foresee a lot of great depth guys and quality rotation players from this group. Almost anyone in the HM group was considered for a spot as high as 7 on the ladder. 1. Kevin McHale - Cleveland Cavaliers (previous: 1)2nd in P/TSA, 1st in scoring, solid defensive numbers... clearly #1. He's the only potential MVP I see in this group.  2. Kiki Vandeweghe - Carolina Cougars (previous: 2)1st in P/TSA, very low TOs, great volume. His rebounding is pedestrian, but that could be because of his teammates down low. Aside from McHale, he's the only player I see that could make an All-League teams going forward from this group.  3. Michael Brooks - Brooklyn Nets (previous: 3)Another spot with no change, Brooks is a great looking player, but lack of 3pt shooting and higher TOs make him a little lower than Kiki to me, despite his solid rebounding numbers.  4. Andrew Toney - Golden State Warriors (previous: 6)The best scoring SG in the class by a wide margin, but that's really his only trick. He's good enough at it and unique enough that he slides ahead of some other wings and bigs with more comparable peers.  5. Larry Smith - Brooklyn Nets (previous: HM)
6. Rick Mahorn - Indiana Pacers (previous: 5)Clearly the two best rebounders in the class, Smith and Mahorn are pretty similar in a lot of ways. Smith is more efficient, Mahorn is a slightly stronger defender.   7. Craig Shelton - Charlotte Hornets (previous: HM)
8. Mike O'Koren - Brooklyn Nets (previous: 4)Both very efficient, moderate scorers from the wing... that don't offer much else. They aren't like the top wings (Vandeweghe/Brooks... or even Toney)... but they are a good bit ahead of the next group.   9. Jawann Oldham - New York Knicks (previous: NR)
10. Lavon Mercer - Cleveland Cavaliers (previous: 8)The best defensive bigs in the class... but neither is as efficient as you want. Oldham's incredibly low usage keeps his TOs down, which is a bonus.   Honorable Mentions:
Points:
Kelvin Ransey - Golden State Warriors
Ronnie Lester - New York Knicks
Darwin Cook - Toronto Raptors
Larry Drew Sr. - Philadelphia 76ers
Wings:
Tony Fuller - Los Angeles Clippers
Bruce Collins - Seattle SuperSonics
Darrell Griffith - Texas Chaparrals
Bigs:
Kurt Rambis - Indiana Pacers
Mike Gminski - San Antonio Spurs
Kurt Nimphius - San Antonio Spurs
Roosevelt Bouie - Seattle SuperSonics
Monti Davis - Washington Bullets Wayne Robinson - Milwaukee Bucks
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bankz
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Post by bankz on Mar 12, 2021 13:38:39 GMT -5
League leader in assists and assists per 36 can't crack a top 10. What a stacked rookie class
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Post by Sapular on Mar 12, 2021 13:50:54 GMT -5
This sir is wrong, a good effort, but wrong |
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Post by delap on Mar 12, 2021 13:51:54 GMT -5
League leader in assists and assists per 36 can't crack a top 10. What a stacked rookie class The 4 HM PGs are incredibly hard to differentiate in talent and direction. Some bias: Cook had A potential to start, was a hidden gem, and still has +20... so I'm pretty bullish on his future. Drew isn't asked to do much in your team and assists are cosmetic in the software, but he's definitely not bad.
If I had to bet one who is the actual best out of those 4 it would be Ransey or Cook, with Drew 3rd... but they are all pretty similar to me right now.
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Post by Trofie on Mar 12, 2021 13:52:09 GMT -5
The Lack of Wayne Robinson is puzzling folks
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Post by delap on Mar 12, 2021 13:56:10 GMT -5
The Lack of Wayne Robinson is puzzling folks
You right, he should be in HM
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Post by Ankly on Mar 12, 2021 13:59:23 GMT -5
This sir is wrong, a good effort, but wrong 9. Jawann Oldham - New York Knicks (previous: NR) 10. Lavon Mercer - Cleveland Cavaliers (previous: 8)  |
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Post by delap on Mar 12, 2021 14:02:41 GMT -5
Oldham and Mercer are very very very very close
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Post by Yawn of the Dead on Mar 12, 2021 14:05:19 GMT -5
Oldham and Mercer are very very very very close It's the 21st century. You don't have to dance around it anymore. |
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Post by 20s on Mar 12, 2021 14:13:14 GMT -5
Oldham and Mercer are just two bachelors saving on rent.
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bankz
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Post by bankz on Mar 12, 2021 14:28:40 GMT -5
Delap taking some heat on these rankings... fyi my comments are all in good fun
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mazunga
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Post by mazunga on Mar 15, 2021 11:59:18 GMT -5
Thank you for giving Shelton the love he deserves.
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Post by delap on Mar 15, 2021 21:06:07 GMT -5
Rookie Ladder - Final UpdateThe most competitive ladder yet. Two legit studs competing for #1, a clear #3, then a bloodbath between #4 and #13 or so. There is no shame in being off the list. My assessment remains that this class will furnish a ton of depth in the league for years to come. Congrats to Sapular for winning by the narrowest of margins. skrouse, please give him the 1k in winnings from my account. 1. Kevin McHale - Cleveland Cavaliers (previous: 1)Ahead of Kiki by basically a coin-flip. His turnovers almost cost him the title, but I expect those to come down as he gets more talent around him. He's an MVP candidate by the end of his rookie deal.  2. Kiki Vandeweghe - Carolina Cougars (previous: 2)A surprising run this season and he was within a hair of winning it all. His pedestrian rebounding is really the main thing that kept him in 2nd place. Still looks great.  3. Michael Brooks - Brooklyn Nets (previous: 3)2nd in P/TSA and elite rebounding from his position, Brooks should be an All-Star candidate from the wing going forward. But... his defense isn't great.  4. Andrew Toney - Golden State Warriors (previous: 4)An absolute elite scorer... who doesn't seem great at anything else... but scoring wins ball games, so Toney gets the spot.  5a. Larry Smith - Brooklyn Nets (previous: 5)
5b. Rick Mahorn - Indiana Pacers (previous: 6)Elite rebounders, good scorers... but lacking a tad on defense. Smith has higher potential, but Mahorn is a better defender... pretty much a wash between these two... so let's call it a tie.   7. Kelvin Ransey - Golden State Warriors (previous: HM)Top PG in the class and software ROTY, he's poised to be a consistent top 8-10 type of PG for his career, assuming normal growth.  8. Kurt Rambis - Indiana Pacers (previous: HM)
9. Jawann Oldham - New York Knicks (previous: 9)The defensive bigs get their shine here on the ladder, with Oldham being a better pure defender and Rambis having a more well-rounded game and even a laudable P/TSA. Rambis' potential gives him the slight edge... but both look great.   10. Mike O'Koren - Texas Chaparrals (previous: 8)O'Koren gets the final spot over Shelton by virtue of higher starting potential. He's a solid scorer that seems destined to be no better than a 3rd wheel on a good team... but that's not the worst thing in the world.  Honorable Mentions:
Points:
Larry Drew Sr. - Philadelphia 76ers
Darwin Cook - Toronto Raptors
Ronnie Lester - New York Knicks
Wings:
Craig Shelton - Charlotte Hornets
Bruce Collins - Seattle SuperSonics
Darrell Griffith - Texas Chaparrals
Bigs:
Mike Gminski - San Antonio Spurs
Roosevelt Bouie - Seattle SuperSonics
Wayne Robinson - Milwaukee Bucks
Lavon Mercer - Cleveland Cavaliers
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