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Post by eric on Oct 7, 2022 9:35:21 GMT -5
because otherwise it's just currency for currency's sake, which is inflationary for no reason Again, you bring up something unrelated that, and you need to admit this to yourself, is not inherently 'good' or 'bad'. Sometimes an idea can be 'good' just because GMs want it to happen. It's like you're operating this entire league with a 'build it and they will come' attitude, which is admirable, but fundamentally flawed since we all know we have a limited pool of GMs and just because you think you've built the perfect set of rules doesn't mean they are a set that the limited pool of GMs we can get to join this game like. This all has to make sense right?
i'm operating the league on a measure twice cut once attitude, or even better a look before you leap attitude, and perhaps most of all a volume doesn't equal volume attitude - no matter how many or how bolded you make your posts, you're still one GM, not the GMs of the league, not even most of the GMs of the league. you do align with the most vocal of the GMs of the league, a group that also makes up the bulk of posts in this thread, but concluding from this that you are in the majority per se is unwarranted the one majority i've always said i'll respect is if an actual majority of the league votes on one new commissioner (and they accept), i'll send the file over that day. this is a real and impactful change, not a tiny adjustment in a currency reward that nobody even cares about in and of itself |
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Post by eric on Oct 7, 2022 9:47:04 GMT -5
because otherwise it's just currency for currency's sake, which is inflationary for no reason Previous post notwithstanding, I can also just address the factual matter of what you said here, which is honestly a ridiculous neocon argument that I thought you were aware was complete bullshit.
You're literally making arguments right now against welfare for poor people. Saying that it would be inflationary. Or saying that raising the minimum wage of the workers of McDonalds will increase the price of Big Macs. Yes, these things are technically true, but will the cost of Big Macs/Upgrades go up as much as the additional currency you're giving to non-playoff teams? No. Because now the McDonalds worker makes 15 an hour instead of 10, and the Big Mac goes up in price by 1 dollar. The burden of the inflation goes to everyone purchasing a Big Mac, not just the poor teams. Of course these nuances are not discussed in your dismissal, is it because you're disingenous or that your mental model of the situation is too simple and doesn't take into account enough variables? Maybe you're not a golden oracle and linear graphs with 2 or 3 variables accounted for are not models that are useful in any analysis of the real world outside of toy problems.
tl;dr the realistic consequence of giving additional currency to bad teams may raise the price of uppies etc, but not as much as the help going to those teams, and because costs are spread over everyone purchasing the goods, the 'balance of economic power' will shift slightly towards the non-playoff teams. THIS IS WHAT WE WANT. And, by extension, THIS IS GOOD. That's the key to all this shit dude, that if the GMs want it, it is good. I don't know how to get such a simple fact through your robot brain.
a central assumption of this counterexample is that bad teams are at a disadvantage in affording upgrades now. this is very true of minimum wage workers in real life, but doesn't turn out to be true for bad teams in sim league - there would not be a shift in economic power to them because they don't turn out to have less income than the playoff teams which makes this a very good example of what i keep coming back to and not getting an answer to: you say there's a problem, and here's a solution, and everyone (for a certain sub 50% value of everyone) likes the solution i say there isn't a problem you say i'm not listening aside from enacting your solution or another solution that accomplishes the same thing, what can i do for you to feel heard? and if the only way is for me to agree with you that there's a problem, can someone just say that? |
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Post by Sapular on Oct 7, 2022 9:50:45 GMT -5
I did try and answer but you did not address half of what I said only points you wanted to. There is no discussing things with you. You asked can you disagree and me not be upset, I said yes. I even went as far as answering the original question. "How can I feel heard?" I told you how to feel heard And you completely dismissed it. you told me to say "I see what you are saying and understand why you, the league want this, but here is why I dont think it is a good idea. We could do X,Y,Z which will have a similar impact or effect and these ways ARE better for the league." and i pointed out that doing so requires me to agree with you on the need for a similar impact or effect my question from the beginning has never been about superficial disagreements on the ways and means of making a change, but fundamental disagreements on the need of making a change at all and for future reference, when i completely dismiss you i won't take hours out of my day to do it Eric I am done engaging in this conversation as it is fruitless. This is not me admitting you are right, this is me not willing engage. |
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killiam bing
New Orleans Jazz
Posts: 777
Likes: 232
Joined: March 2022
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Post by killiam bing on Oct 7, 2022 11:34:08 GMT -5
Previous post notwithstanding, I can also just address the factual matter of what you said here, which is honestly a ridiculous neocon argument that I thought you were aware was complete bullshit.
You're literally making arguments right now against welfare for poor people. Saying that it would be inflationary. Or saying that raising the minimum wage of the workers of McDonalds will increase the price of Big Macs. Yes, these things are technically true, but will the cost of Big Macs/Upgrades go up as much as the additional currency you're giving to non-playoff teams? No. Because now the McDonalds worker makes 15 an hour instead of 10, and the Big Mac goes up in price by 1 dollar. The burden of the inflation goes to everyone purchasing a Big Mac, not just the poor teams. Of course these nuances are not discussed in your dismissal, is it because you're disingenous or that your mental model of the situation is too simple and doesn't take into account enough variables? Maybe you're not a golden oracle and linear graphs with 2 or 3 variables accounted for are not models that are useful in any analysis of the real world outside of toy problems.
tl;dr the realistic consequence of giving additional currency to bad teams may raise the price of uppies etc, but not as much as the help going to those teams, and because costs are spread over everyone purchasing the goods, the 'balance of economic power' will shift slightly towards the non-playoff teams. THIS IS WHAT WE WANT. And, by extension, THIS IS GOOD. That's the key to all this shit dude, that if the GMs want it, it is good. I don't know how to get such a simple fact through your robot brain.
a central assumption of this counterexample is that bad teams are at a disadvantage in affording upgrades now. this is very true of minimum wage workers in real life, but doesn't turn out to be true for bad teams in sim league - there would not be a shift in economic power to them because they don't turn out to have less income than the playoff teams which makes this a very good example of what i keep coming back to and not getting an answer to: you say there's a problem, and here's a solution, and everyone (for a certain sub 50% value of everyone) likes the solution i say there isn't a problem you say i'm not listening aside from enacting your solution or another solution that accomplishes the same thing, what can i do for you to feel heard? and if the only way is for me to agree with you that there's a problem, can someone just say that?
Eric, no one ever said there was a problem. You're inferring stuff again where it doesn't exist. The issue isn't that non playoff teams have problems paying for upgrades, the issue is to give the non playoff teams more currency. That's it. It doesn't really matter the reason for it.
There is like a 50000 word document that documents the rules in this league, if every single one of those had to go through your process for creating new rules half of them wouldn't exist. A lot of them don't solve any problem, but still exist. A lot of them contribute to what some people think are 'problems' and yet still exist. |
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killiam bing
New Orleans Jazz
Posts: 777
Likes: 232
Joined: March 2022
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Post by killiam bing on Oct 7, 2022 11:43:15 GMT -5
Again, you bring up something unrelated that, and you need to admit this to yourself, is not inherently 'good' or 'bad'. Sometimes an idea can be 'good' just because GMs want it to happen. It's like you're operating this entire league with a 'build it and they will come' attitude, which is admirable, but fundamentally flawed since we all know we have a limited pool of GMs and just because you think you've built the perfect set of rules doesn't mean they are a set that the limited pool of GMs we can get to join this game like. This all has to make sense right?
i'm operating the league on a measure twice cut once attitude, or even better a look before you leap attitude, and perhaps most of all a volume doesn't equal volume attitude - no matter how many or how bolded you make your posts, you're still one GM, not the GMs of the league, not even most of the GMs of the league. you do align with the most vocal of the GMs of the league, a group that also makes up the bulk of posts in this thread, but concluding from this that you are in the majority per se is unwarranted the one majority i've always said i'll respect is if an actual majority of the league votes on one new commissioner (and they accept), i'll send the file over that day. this is a real and impactful change, not a tiny adjustment in a currency reward that nobody even cares about in and of itself
This is fine eric that you are operating this way, but that doesn't mean it is the best way to operate. Your ultimatum level threat "if you don't like me just get someone else" is a perfect example of how difficult you are to deal with and why people feel like they aren't being heard. Just because we don't want to replace you as commissioner doesn't mean everything you say is right, or that we support everything you say as being right.
What is happening in this thread, and has been happening in shouts, and in the hearts and mind of ex and current GMs is more a desire for control. Again, I'll point back to U.S. politics. Even though democracy is imperfect, it is still preferential to a dictatorship, even a benevolent one. In a dictatorship you hear "petitions" from us, and then decide how to address them and what to do. Why is it like that? Do you think it HAS to be like this?
I'm in many sim leagues, across many sports, some that involve money and some that don't. The best kind of leagues and the ones with the best GM retention are ones where the GMs themselves decide on the rules, not some benevolent commissioner that "hears petitions".
What we need to move this forward is a different method of handling rule changes, if that happens I think it would make me, and perhaps others, feel heard. There should be some sort of system, that everyone is aware of, that voting in threads does actually matter and can change the rules. You wonder why our league discussion threads only see half the GMs vote on them? Don't you think it's because the results of the polls are likely not even honored, except possibly in spirit, so why even bother?
You want to prove that you're listening? Give the GMs the control of their league rules. 1 GM, 1 Vote. What the majority wants, the majority gets. Give it 1 week to vote, or 2 weeks, or 69 hours. Those details doesn't matter, the important thing is that GMs know that they can have control over how their league runs, and their opinions/votes will be counted and what the most people want they will get.
Do you know why this matters? Let's think about it a little bit. If Majic posts some dumbass rule he wants implemented and its a mixed bag of votes and then you come in with some data and say "this rule is dumb because of X, we won't be doing it", you haven't listened and majic didn't feel heard. Now, under the proposed system, Majic can post some dumbass rule, and the GMs vote on it. If Majics rule wins then it is implemented, if it doesn't win it isn't implemented. I guarantee you Majic will not feel "unheard" after that, his proposal will have been voted down by his peers and shown that his peers do not want to be in a league with that rule. Majic and other GMs are much more likely to respect a decision by the group about what they want than a decision from you based on some stupid ass formula.
Of course, there are possible downsides to this which you mentioned above, mentioning that if 51% of GMs vote for something 49% of GMs aren't getting what they want. This is true. Everyone won't get what they want in democracy. But you know what they will have? They will have felt heard. And they will have been heard. It's as simple as that.
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Post by eric on Oct 7, 2022 15:19:37 GMT -5
you told me to say "I see what you are saying and understand why you, the league want this, but here is why I dont think it is a good idea. We could do X,Y,Z which will have a similar impact or effect and these ways ARE better for the league." and i pointed out that doing so requires me to agree with you on the need for a similar impact or effect my question from the beginning has never been about superficial disagreements on the ways and means of making a change, but fundamental disagreements on the need of making a change at all and for future reference, when i completely dismiss you i won't take hours out of my day to do it Eric I am done engaging in this conversation as it is fruitless. This is not me admitting you are right, this is me not willing engage. right about what? i'm asking the same simple question i've been asking from the start, that no one including you has answered, for reasons i've explained repeatedly when we disagree on the need of making a change, how can you feel heard? i recognize you already said i have to offer another solution that accomplishes that change, what i'm saying is that's necessarily not a disagreement on the need of making a change. this is not a semantic or picayune distinction |
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Post by eric on Oct 7, 2022 15:29:37 GMT -5
a central assumption of this counterexample is that bad teams are at a disadvantage in affording upgrades now. this is very true of minimum wage workers in real life, but doesn't turn out to be true for bad teams in sim league - there would not be a shift in economic power to them because they don't turn out to have less income than the playoff teams which makes this a very good example of what i keep coming back to and not getting an answer to: you say there's a problem, and here's a solution, and everyone (for a certain sub 50% value of everyone) likes the solution i say there isn't a problem you say i'm not listening aside from enacting your solution or another solution that accomplishes the same thing, what can i do for you to feel heard? and if the only way is for me to agree with you that there's a problem, can someone just say that? Eric, no one ever said there was a problem. You're inferring stuff again where it doesn't exist. The issue isn't that non playoff teams have problems paying for upgrades, the issue is to give the non playoff teams more currency. That's it. It doesn't really matter the reason for it.
There is like a 50000 word document that documents the rules in this league, if every single one of those had to go through your process for creating new rules half of them wouldn't exist. A lot of them don't solve any problem, but still exist. A lot of them contribute to what some people think are 'problems' and yet still exist. tim explicitly said there was a specific problem i said that problem doesn't exist, ergo the proposed solution will cause a problem without solving anything you offered a real world metaphor as proof that that specific problem actually did exist i reiterated that the problem doesn't exist in sim league, and explained how the metaphor failed i didn't infer anything, at any point, from anyone it's important to be precise about these things, not for point scoring in some imaginary adversarial environment, but for actual communication. specific things were said by specific people, and specific responses were made to those specific things |
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Post by Sapular on Oct 7, 2022 15:40:03 GMT -5
Eric I am done engaging in this conversation as it is fruitless. This is not me admitting you are right, this is me not willing engage. right about what? i'm asking the same simple question i've been asking from the start, that no one including you has answered, for reasons i've explained repeatedly when we disagree on the need of making a change, how can you feel heard? i recognize you already said i have to offer another solution that accomplishes that change, what i'm saying is that's necessarily not a disagreement on the need of making a change. this is not a semantic or picayune distinction That was a small part of what I said. You chose THAT part. I also said, acknowledge our point of view. Fine, dont offer a solution. Not a big deal. Simply acknowledge what we asked or want then provide a reason why a different route or no route is better. "You know what Sap, I hear ya and understand what you are looking for but based on A,B and C we are not going to go that direction". This is not much different than what I said originally. |
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Post by eric on Oct 7, 2022 15:47:26 GMT -5
i'm operating the league on a measure twice cut once attitude, or even better a look before you leap attitude, and perhaps most of all a volume doesn't equal volume attitude - no matter how many or how bolded you make your posts, you're still one GM, not the GMs of the league, not even most of the GMs of the league. you do align with the most vocal of the GMs of the league, a group that also makes up the bulk of posts in this thread, but concluding from this that you are in the majority per se is unwarranted the one majority i've always said i'll respect is if an actual majority of the league votes on one new commissioner (and they accept), i'll send the file over that day. this is a real and impactful change, not a tiny adjustment in a currency reward that nobody even cares about in and of itself This is fine eric that you are operating this way, but that doesn't mean it is the best way to operate. Your ultimatum level threat "if you don't like me just get someone else" is a perfect example of how difficult you are to deal with and why people feel like they aren't being heard. Just because we don't want to replace you as commissioner doesn't mean everything you say is right, or that we support everything you say as being right. What is happening in this thread, and has been happening in shouts, and in the hearts and mind of ex and current GMs is more a desire for control. Again, I'll point back to U.S. politics. Even though democracy is imperfect, it is still preferential to a dictatorship, even a benevolent one. In a dictatorship you hear "petitions" from us, and then decide how to address them and what to do. Why is it like that? Do you think it HAS to be like this? I'm in many sim leagues, across many sports, some that involve money and some that don't. The best kind of leagues and the ones with the best GM retention are ones where the GMs themselves decide on the rules, not some benevolent commissioner that "hears petitions".
What we need to move this forward is a different method of handling rule changes, if that happens I think it would make me, and perhaps others, feel heard. There should be some sort of system, that everyone is aware of, that voting in threads does actually matter and can change the rules. You wonder why our league discussion threads only see half the GMs vote on them? Don't you think it's because the results of the polls are likely not even honored, except possibly in spirit, so why even bother?
You want to prove that you're listening? Give the GMs the control of their league rules. 1 GM, 1 Vote. What the majority wants, the majority gets. Give it 1 week to vote, or 2 weeks, or 69 hours. Those details doesn't matter, the important thing is that GMs know that they can have control over how their league runs, and their opinions/votes will be counted and what the most people want they will get.
Do you know why this matters? Let's think about it a little bit. If Majic posts some dumbass rule he wants implemented and its a mixed bag of votes and then you come in with some data and say "this rule is dumb because of X, we won't be doing it", you haven't listened and majic didn't feel heard. Now, under the proposed system, Majic can post some dumbass rule, and the GMs vote on it. If Majics rule wins then it is implemented, if it doesn't win it isn't implemented. I guarantee you Majic will not feel "unheard" after that, his proposal will have been voted down by his peers and shown that his peers do not want to be in a league with that rule. Majic and other GMs are much more likely to respect a decision by the group about what they want than a decision from you based on some stupid ass formula. Of course, there are possible downsides to this which you mentioned above, mentioning that if 51% of GMs vote for something 49% of GMs aren't getting what they want. This is true. Everyone won't get what they want in democracy. But you know what they will have? They will have felt heard. And they will have been heard. It's as simple as that.
and continuing from the previous point, nobody threatened anybody. i offered a specific data point of how i would listen to the league on something extremely fundamental to the league, ergo it is ludicrous to accuse me of ignoring the league (or "the league") on something extremely superficial, when the very plausible alternative explanation is i looked into it and you just happen to be factually incorrect about the impact of that extremely superficial matter continuing on that point, i don't wonder why most league discussion threads see such low votes, i am confident it's because they are mostly about incredibly minor issues that barely make any difference either way. again, the amount of noise a discussion generates is not indicative of anything but how much noise people want to make, a choice that is in no way proportional to population size but these are side points, because now we finally have an answer "You want to prove that you're listening? Give the GMs the control of their league rules." this has always been about you just wanting to get what you want which is fine! it baffles me that it took us the days of this thread and the weeks and months of how often these type of discussions came up in the past to get here you just want to get what you want, and that's fine! and i'm not going to give it to you, and that should be fine too! because literally no TMBSL commissioner has ever commissioned that way all i ask going forward is can we please dispense with the 'you're IGNORING US!!! you're not LISTENING!!!' stuff when what you mean is you didn't get what you want that particular time. no kidding you didn't get what you want! we can all see you didn't get what you want, we can all guess you're not thrilled about it, who would be? what's exhausting to me is the theater of it, how every last thing has to be a grand evaluation on commissioner style and the league is dying and f*** the wheel by the way and won't anyone PLEASE think of the crummy 20k currency that's somehow escalated to life and death importance. isn't the pretense exhausting to you? |
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Post by eric on Oct 7, 2022 15:48:39 GMT -5
right about what? i'm asking the same simple question i've been asking from the start, that no one including you has answered, for reasons i've explained repeatedly when we disagree on the need of making a change, how can you feel heard? i recognize you already said i have to offer another solution that accomplishes that change, what i'm saying is that's necessarily not a disagreement on the need of making a change. this is not a semantic or picayune distinction That was a small part of what I said. You chose THAT part. I also said, acknowledge our point of view. Fine, dont offer a solution. Not a big deal. Simply acknowledge what we asked or want then provide a reason why a different route or no route is better. "You know what Sap, I hear ya and understand what you are looking for but based on A,B and C we are not going to go that direction". This is not much different than what I said originally. okay then going back to the 8-0 thread, what would you change about the post i made |
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Post by Fason on Oct 7, 2022 15:51:02 GMT -5
Just lock this thread
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Post by Majic on Oct 7, 2022 15:59:39 GMT -5
i don't wonder why most league discussion threads see such low votes For the record, I am a fairly active GM and rarely vote in discussion posts for the sole reason that unless eric has given support it wont matter. Whether its 3 votes or 15 votes, if eric isn't supporting it we wont get it approved. So I dont really vote. "You want to prove that you're listening? Give the GMs the control of their league rules." this has always been about you just wanting to get what you want I completely disagree with this statement. In my opinion you dont own the league and if the league wants something thats been voted on it should happen. Whether there is a "problem" to fix or not, if GM's want something added then it should happen. I will state here something I said in shout, I would love for us to come to an agreement on what parameters a vote would need to meet in order for it to go into affect. Set a number of total votes and the % needed for approval. Make it a black and white rule so that everyone understands what is needed and there is no bickering about it. |
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killiam bing
New Orleans Jazz
Posts: 777
Likes: 232
Joined: March 2022
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Post by killiam bing on Oct 8, 2022 7:24:39 GMT -5
"You want to prove that you're listening? Give the GMs the control of their league rules." this has always been about you just wanting to get what you want Shame on you eric for reading my post and getting this from it. I can't believe you'd be so fucking stupid. It's like you don't give a shit about whether this league survives or not. |
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Post by montrealdude on Oct 8, 2022 9:00:14 GMT -5
here is data that should help  |
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Post by eric on Oct 8, 2022 15:30:03 GMT -5
"You want to prove that you're listening? Give the GMs the control of their league rules." this has always been about you just wanting to get what you want Shame on you eric for reading my post and getting this from it. I can't believe you'd be so fucking stupid. It's like you don't give a shit about whether this league survives or not. as you know but we can pretend needs to be shown anyway, we have two controlled experiments for this first we have the span of my commissioner tenure, in which time the number of GMs has gone up and down and largely been right around where it is now, this despite my being constant in my approach to deadlines, rule changes, communication, or anything else. i am who i am, and after going on four years the league still survives second on the specific topic of democratic rule changes, that's never been a part of tmbsl under any commissioner i've seen, and i'd be shocked if it ever was prior. that's what, ten years? and the league is in fact still going so the issue isn't that i don't care about whether the league survives, the issue is that you happen to be incorrect about what's required for a league to survive - it's not democratic rule changes, it's not you, it's not me. the league did just fine without any of that, if the league voted me out tomorrow and then you the next day it'd do just fine then too so i have to ask again, don't you get tired of every little thing being an existential catastrophe? when you don't get your way on whatever rule change, whether it's a missing playoffs reward or the rule change system itself, is it so hard to say "oh well" and move on with your life, as opposed to launching another referendum on how the league is dying and drastic change is needed and everyone who disagrees is stupid and not listening and i'm exhausted just typing this out, sheesh! i never think about what GMs should or shouldn't do, who should make what trade, draft what player, it seems to me you'd save yourself a lot of angst and energy doing the same and leaving the commissioning to the commissioner, i think when you step back and look at it dispassionately you'll see how minor and mundane it all really is or we can keep going through this every few weeks, your call really |
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Post by eric on Oct 8, 2022 15:47:10 GMT -5
i don't wonder why most league discussion threads see such low votes For the record, I am a fairly active GM and rarely vote in discussion posts for the sole reason that unless eric has given support it wont matter. Whether its 3 votes or 15 votes, if eric isn't supporting it we wont get it approved. So I dont really vote. "You want to prove that you're listening? Give the GMs the control of their league rules." this has always been about you just wanting to get what you want I completely disagree with this statement. In my opinion you dont own the league and if the league wants something thats been voted on it should happen. Whether there is a "problem" to fix or not, if GM's want something added then it should happen. I will state here something I said in shout, I would love for us to come to an agreement on what parameters a vote would need to meet in order for it to go into affect. Set a number of total votes and the % needed for approval. Make it a black and white rule so that everyone understands what is needed and there is no bickering about it. the point of the commissioner isn't owning the league, the point of the commissioner is GMs don't trust other GMs to act in the league's best interests... which they shouldn't! so you shouldn't! GMs should each act in their own best interests and expect every other GM to do the same you're coming at this as though it's the league vs. me, it's not. the league is made up of individuals each with their own motives that sometimes align and sometimes don't, somebody's gotta be the referee and as an aside, it kills me that you genuinely think a black and white rule would prevent bickering. if my tenure is marked by anything it's strict adherence to black and white rules and surely we can all agree bickering has not been eliminated, and that's ME enacting them rather than your fellow GMs who stand to gain by sabotaging you. no bickering? c'mon already |
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killiam bing
New Orleans Jazz
Posts: 777
Likes: 232
Joined: March 2022
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Post by killiam bing on Oct 9, 2022 7:39:47 GMT -5
Shame on you eric for reading my post and getting this from it. I can't believe you'd be so fucking stupid. It's like you don't give a shit about whether this league survives or not. as you know but we can pretend needs to be shown anyway, we have two controlled experiments for this first we have the span of my commissioner tenure, in which time the number of GMs has gone up and down and largely been right around where it is now, this despite my being constant in my approach to deadlines, rule changes, communication, or anything else. i am who i am, and after going on four years the league still survives second on the specific topic of democratic rule changes, that's never been a part of tmbsl under any commissioner i've seen, and i'd be shocked if it ever was prior. that's what, ten years? and the league is in fact still going so the issue isn't that i don't care about whether the league survives, the issue is that you happen to be incorrect about what's required for a league to survive - it's not democratic rule changes, it's not you, it's not me. the league did just fine without any of that, if the league voted me out tomorrow and then you the next day it'd do just fine then too so i have to ask again, don't you get tired of every little thing being an existential catastrophe? when you don't get your way on whatever rule change, whether it's a missing playoffs reward or the rule change system itself, is it so hard to say "oh well" and move on with your life, as opposed to launching another referendum on how the league is dying and drastic change is needed and everyone who disagrees is stupid and not listening and i'm exhausted just typing this out, sheesh! i never think about what GMs should or shouldn't do, who should make what trade, draft what player, it seems to me you'd save yourself a lot of angst and energy doing the same and leaving the commissioning to the commissioner, i think when you step back and look at it dispassionately you'll see how minor and mundane it all really is or we can keep going through this every few weeks, your call really
Wait you're saying no other commissioner has had to have this kind of system? I am shocked. Surprised. Flabbergasted.
Maybe none of the other commissioners required a system like this because they actually fucking listened to the GMs and weren't robots?
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Post by eric on Oct 9, 2022 16:13:45 GMT -5
as you know but we can pretend needs to be shown anyway, we have two controlled experiments for this first we have the span of my commissioner tenure, in which time the number of GMs has gone up and down and largely been right around where it is now, this despite my being constant in my approach to deadlines, rule changes, communication, or anything else. i am who i am, and after going on four years the league still survives second on the specific topic of democratic rule changes, that's never been a part of tmbsl under any commissioner i've seen, and i'd be shocked if it ever was prior. that's what, ten years? and the league is in fact still going so the issue isn't that i don't care about whether the league survives, the issue is that you happen to be incorrect about what's required for a league to survive - it's not democratic rule changes, it's not you, it's not me. the league did just fine without any of that, if the league voted me out tomorrow and then you the next day it'd do just fine then too so i have to ask again, don't you get tired of every little thing being an existential catastrophe? when you don't get your way on whatever rule change, whether it's a missing playoffs reward or the rule change system itself, is it so hard to say "oh well" and move on with your life, as opposed to launching another referendum on how the league is dying and drastic change is needed and everyone who disagrees is stupid and not listening and i'm exhausted just typing this out, sheesh! i never think about what GMs should or shouldn't do, who should make what trade, draft what player, it seems to me you'd save yourself a lot of angst and energy doing the same and leaving the commissioning to the commissioner, i think when you step back and look at it dispassionately you'll see how minor and mundane it all really is or we can keep going through this every few weeks, your call really Wait you're saying no other commissioner has had to have this kind of system? I am shocked. Surprised. Flabbergasted. Maybe none of the other commissioners required a system like this because they actually fucking listened to the GMs and weren't robots?
what i said was no other commissioner ever had it, not had to have it, and yet the league went on just fine what i also said was four years for me in particular, and yet the league still went on just fine it's a simple experiment on your proposed hypothesis bill, when you get all heated it just makes you more incorrect. like i said, it's your call  |
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killiam bing
New Orleans Jazz
Posts: 777
Likes: 232
Joined: March 2022
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Post by killiam bing on Oct 9, 2022 18:53:43 GMT -5
Wait you're saying no other commissioner has had to have this kind of system? I am shocked. Surprised. Flabbergasted. Maybe none of the other commissioners required a system like this because they actually fucking listened to the GMs and weren't robots?
what i said was no other commissioner ever had it, not had to have it, and yet the league went on just fine what i also said was four years for me in particular, and yet the league still went on just fine it's a simple experiment on your proposed hypothesis bill, when you get all heated it just makes you more incorrect. like i said, it's your call Yeah it’s been four years and people have figured out you’re never going to listen and are tired of it. But whatever dude. It’s sad you’re gonna kill the league with your continued insolence but all good things I guess |
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killiam bing
New Orleans Jazz
Posts: 777
Likes: 232
Joined: March 2022
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Post by killiam bing on Oct 12, 2022 8:38:34 GMT -5
Ok, so players are modeled after their real-life counterparts as much as you can control them to do so. In order to have players modeled in such a way, you must do some research into their real-life stats prior to building them and... ...personal biases of the Draft Master - a role that is generally undesirable as made evident by the high turnover - will not be acknowledged, despite it being one of the few things that can add entertainment to the role... Leads me to the question... Why is there a draft master and why are there profiles? Why don't we back the compensation back down to 25,000 and I'll just list out the 10 profile players whose stats you should research, and then do the strengths for non-profile guys (or we can just randomize them because that's pretty much what I do anyway). It's clear they're very rarely read and my spending 3-4 hours every two weeks to write them all seems like an enormous waste of time. the same reason we have every board duty, to make the commissioner's job easier. right now it's much easier for me to make edits to profiles than write them from scratch, because you specifically aren't far or frequently off, mostly it's just things like backing "great" down to "good" or adjusting for how certain irl attributes are reflected in the software in 5.0 and into 6.0 i operated under the assumption that people were making fair profiles, because it never came up as a question. bk's approach made it clear that assumption was not valid, and maybe it never was, i'd have to go back and look to evaluate exact degrees i certainly don't blame you if you feel undercompensated for your time, like all board duties it's mostly ignored and when it's not it's criticism. if there were a way to automate it the way i did improvements history i would, but i don't know of such a way
also fuck you for thinking i wrote any unfair profiles
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